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Melodyne DNA technology
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Gorecki
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Joined: 24 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 11:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ironically yesterday I had a fieldside conversation with another soccer dad who works as an engineer. He has had a previous version of the plugin and said it wasn't good. Lot's of artifacts and stuff.

But..he just got the new version and is TOTALLY thrilled. I mean, 'where have you been all my life' thrilled.

Just some feedback from someone who owns it. Also said GC and MF have it on sale. Wink
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kbgtr001



Joined: 04 May 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 5:03 pm    Post subject: Melodyne DNA, iZotope RX, Pro Tools 'Elastic Audio' Reply with quote

Gorecki wrote:
Ironically yesterday I had a fieldside conversation with another soccer dad who works as an engineer. He has had a previous version of the plugin and said it wasn't good. Lot's of artifacts and stuff.

But..he just got the new version and is TOTALLY thrilled. I mean, 'where have you been all my life' thrilled.

Just some feedback from someone who owns it. Also said GC and MF have it on sale. Wink



Good to have other informed opinions.
Don't know which version of the plug-in he had been using or his application, but I agree the quality is excellent. Of course, much depends on how it used, issues with the audio source etc... just purchased mine within the past few months or so.

The 'Direct Note Access technology' as the Melodyne people call it, is slated for the fall of this year according to the web site info.

Another interesting software tool to check out is iZotope RX...
for NR and audio restoration;

http://www.izotope.com/products/audio/rx/

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/RX/

Two versions; Rx (great price) and Rx advanced (expensive).

The considerably less expensive Rx will do the same high quality processing work as the 'advanced version.'


I have the 'Amazing Slow-downer' and some other software pieces that I'd been using to slow down audio files and for 'transcribing' (coping solos).

I now use the the Pro tools 'Elastic Audio' feature available in Pro Tools 7.4. Some demo movies at the Digide$ign website;

http://www.digidesign.com/index.cfm?langid=100&navid=48&itemid=28112&ref=74-f

I like the flexibility and that the entire audio source is available on a track. Easily adjust 'tempo' in audio files at any point in the time line. The 'quality' is fine for the purpose; I just need it to work for slowing down the audio to focus on instrument lines. It's an easy, very basic use of this feature. It has other applications too, but not necessary to discuss that here.

Other DAW applications may have a similar feature which is excellent. I'm interested to hear/learn about it. I'm a long time Pro Tools user, so that's what I discuss. I'm not trying to 'convert' anyone or 'sell' anything. Anyway, always thought it's easier to get people to convert their religion than it is to get them to change their sequencer (or DAW, computer platform etc).

Mark has mentioned he uses GarageBand. There's a lot to like about it plus it's convenient and easy to use. My only issue with it is that it does not 'export' midi files. 'Import' midi file is fine but no 'export.' At least in my version that was bundled in an earlier 'iLife package.' I don't think that has changed. I need the midi export, so I usually work in Pro Tools and Cubase.


-kb
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Mark
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 6:52 pm    Post subject: Re: ASD vs Transcribe Reply with quote

kbgtr001 wrote:
I have the 'Amazing Slow-downer' and some other software pieces that I'd been using to slow down audio files and for 'transcribing' (coping solos).

Mark has mentioned he uses GarageBand. There's a lot to like about it plus it's convenient and easy to use. My only issue with it is that it does not 'export' midi files. 'Import' midi file is fine but no 'export.' At least in my version that was bundled in an earlier 'iLife package.' I don't think that has changed. I need the midi export, so I usually work in Pro Tools and Cubase.


Kb,

I assume that you have Transcribe by Andy Robinson of Seventh String Software? Hands down for my $$ the only transcribing software that truly deserves the word "amazing" in its title. Wink

The latest version syncs MPEG video with the waveform window, so now you can pull any guitar clips from YouTube (Benson, Pass, Wes, etc, etc), convert the file format with a simple program like Visual Hub, then open it in Transcribe. When you slow down the audio the video slows down right along with it. You can also convert from standard DVDs and do the same thing, which turns any performance video into a learning affair. This is one of the greatest (if not the greatest) breakthrough in transcribing and visual learning for guitarists, but the program was terrific long before this update. For the record, my colleagues Wolf Marshall and Henry Johnson do all of their transcribing work using Transcribe, for good reason.

Yes, ProTools was my program of choice for many years, but almost all of the recordings I've done during the past two years have been in Garage Band. I rarely use it for midi, although I've frequently converted midi tracks from the Jam Central Station page to MP3 format and then just dropped them into a GB session and recorded my guitar parts.

As one of many examples using that method, click here to hear a recent solo I recorded using the "Thrill Is Gone" track from the JCS page. The transcription will be released shortly. All for now...

- Mark
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Larry_DC



Joined: 31 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are so many recording tools out there it's hard to decide what to get.
Meanwhile, I convert Mark's JCS jam tracks to WAV files and copy them to Transcribe. There are so many tracks on JCS, I have to wonder how many people have down loaded the whole collection. Next I have to figure out how to record while I'm playing along so I can play it back and see where I need to make improvements.

Mark, speaking of your Thrill Is Gone solo, will it be available in your Monster Guitar Solo series?
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Mark
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Larry_DC wrote:
There are so many tracks on JCS, I have to wonder how many people have down loaded the whole collection. Next I have to figure out how to record while I'm playing along so I can play it back and see where I need to make improvements.

Mark, speaking of your Thrill Is Gone solo, will it be available in your Monster Guitar Solo series?


Larry,

Even though over two thousand players use the JCS page each day, many aren't aware of what can be done with the tracks beyond the online jamming experience. Like making custom jam CDs, recording heads, solos, rhythm parts, etc, in programs like PT or GB. I mean, you can even do as I've done and compose original melodies using related chord progressions. And, of course, since the tracks are midi-based, keys, tempo, and instrumentation can all be modified prior to digital audio conversion.

Btw, one of the many things I'd like to see happen in this forum is an ongoing discussion in the Jam Central Station topic area, with players of all levels exchanging their thoughts and approaches spanning everything from a two-chord groove like "Listen Here" (Eddie Harris) to "Stormy Monday" (T-Bone Walker), "Tenor Madness" (Sonny Rollins), "Giant Steps" (Trane), and so on. Personally, I think the value for all concerned would be off the map, and the cool thing is that whatever ideas that are shared could immediately be tried out right here at VM. It would also be relatively easy to post notational examples and MP3 clips as part of the conversations. Comments, anyone?

Yes, the "Thrill Is Gone" solo is one of seven new releases in the series, all of which will be available within the next few days. They are all fully transcribed and scored (Finale), which is the most tedious part of the job, and four of the group involve backing tracks from JCS. The series has been so well-received by my colleagues, students, and fans that I'll be pitching it heavily beginning with the next issue of Just Jazz Guitar magazine.

For a preview of the new half-page ad (design courtesy of Dave Gill), click here. All for now...

- Mark
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kbgtr001



Joined: 04 May 2007
Posts: 122

PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 6:24 am    Post subject: Re: ASD vs Transcribe Reply with quote

Mark wrote:


I now use the the Pro tools 'Elastic Audio' feature available in Pro Tools 7.4. Some demo movies at the Digide$ign website;

http://www.digidesign.com/index.cfm?langid=100&navid=48&itemid=28112&ref=74-f

I like the flexibility and that the entire audio source is available on a track. Easily adjust 'tempo' in audio files at any point in the time line. The 'quality' is fine for the purpose; I just need it to work for slowing down the audio to focus on instrument lines. It's an easy, very basic use of this feature.

----------------------------

Kb,

I assume that you have Transcribe by Andy Robinson of Seventh String Software? Hands down for my $$ the only transcribing software that truly deserves the word "amazing" in its title. Wink

The latest version syncs MPEG video with the waveform window, so now you can pull any guitar clips from YouTube (Benson, Pass, Wes, etc, etc), convert the file format with a simple program like Visual Hub, then open it in Transcribe. When you slow down the audio the video slows down right along with it. You can also convert from standard DVDs and do the same thing, which turns any performance video into a learning affair. This is one of the greatest (if not the greatest) breakthrough in transcribing and visual learning for guitarists, but the program was terrific long before this update.

- Mark




'Transcribe' is a terrific program. As I mentioned, I'm pretty much using Pro Tools with 'elastic audio' for this purpose now. Just working with audio in the time line has a high degree of flexibility, more so than Transcribe or the others mentioned. I did not purchase Pro Tools for this specific purpose, however. I use Pro tools for many things and now it happens to have this feature, which I can put to use in an interesting, creative way. The same is true for 'Melodyne.' I already have Melodyne integrated into my Pro Tools rig, plus it's also in a flexible VST plug-in format that works in other applications. When the next version should come around, I'll use it. Not for any single specific task, but simply because it's part of my work-a-day world. If I can put it to work in an unexpected, interesting and creative way; all the better.

I really like the keyboard graphic player in the Transcribe window. It resizes nicely, very easy to see. The keyboard is very useful for searching out pitches in phrases and it's great for 'singing' along with isolated phrases. I like singing through phrases, licks, whatever when I'm learning them. I try do the singing thing as much as possible. Not looking to be a vocalist, just find it to be a great way to 'internalize' lines, phrases, scales etc. When I travel around town on the subway, I often have an iPod with a library snippets of lines, licks, phrases that I listen to and sing along. Yes, I'm the guy sitting at the end of the subway car singing to himself. I also carry song books and other score materials and get my pitch from a very portable Korg MA-30 metronome.

The video feature in Transcribe is very cool. I use the *free* 'Perian' and
Quicktime Pro on my iMac G5 for converting flash flv downloads from youtube.


http://perian.org/


short demo movie on how to download movies from youtube with Safari and use Quicktime with Perian;

http://perian.org/#watch


-kb
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Mark
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 7:56 am    Post subject: Re: ASD vs Transcribe Reply with quote

kbgtr001 wrote:
The keyboard is very useful for searching out pitches in phrases and it's great for 'singing' along with isolated phrases. I like singing through phrases, licks, whatever when I'm learning them. I try do the singing thing as much as possible. Not looking to be a vocalist, just find it to be a great way to 'internalize' lines, phrases, scales etc. When I travel around town on the subway, I often have an iPod with a library snippets of lines, licks, phrases that I listen to and sing along. Yes, I'm the guy sitting at the end of the subway car singing to himself.


Kb,

Damn, I was wondering who that was! Laughing

Seriously, singing what you hear, whether transcribing from others or something that now resides inside your ear from that process, is a critical part of the improvising, arranging, and composing equation. I write all of my original compositions that way, because it eliminates my mind and the guitar itself, leaving only what I can hum or sing. As a result, I seem to always arrive at something more musical, as opposed to technical or theoretical. When someone tells me that they can't get the melody out of their head after one or two listens, I know that I've got it.

It kind of goes hand in hand with what my late father used to say about solos and tunes: "If you can't walk away humming at least some of what you heard, it wasn't worth remembering." So I'm totally with you on the singing front. You probably just failed to spot me at the other end of that subway car. Wink

I'll check out Perian. All for now...

- Mark
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Dean



Joined: 19 Apr 2007
Posts: 287
Location: California

PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went old school on all my amps.....point to point wire ,and 50 's style tubes.Tone wood ,cabinets,my 300B has the 50's 15" jbl D 130 in it ,the holy grail of speakers.Tone tubbys in my two 12,it's got that Clapton beno sound.I did all this to get the most out of my hands and the guitar.I have a few effects around ,but I do not use them much.

I do like the tool ,in this thread.It looks to have a lot of good uses,and probably would help in a recording or transcribe realm.I just am not on that level yet.I am looking for the best way to record and post some of my stuff ,tho.Any one have a tried and true system ,please PM me.
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Gorecki
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dean, start here
http://www.visionmusic.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=21

I'd go more into it but am busy, busy busy!
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Dean



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Gorecki,I talked to my son the other day,and I mite get pro tools for my pc.He likes it ,and is going with the rack,but said I could go with the two channel for what I need.What do you think?
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Dean



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark ,that rendition of the thrill is gone.....was to cool,the sweep picking and vibrato ,that is the stuff.Just sweet lines.
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Mark
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dean wrote:
Mark ,that rendition of the thrill is gone.....was to cool,the sweep picking and vibrato ,that is the stuff.Just sweet lines.


Thanks, my friend. From your reaction I can tell that you and I are clearly cut from the blues cloth. With all due respect to so many of my esteemed esoteric jazz colleagues, music devoid of the soulfulness that emanates from a pure love of the blues does very little for me. I think it's really sad that so many in the jazz genre recognize the historical importance of blues, yet fail to pay it anything but lip service. All for now...

- Mark
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Gorecki
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dean wrote:
Thanks Gorecki,I talked to my son the other day,and I mite get pro tools for my pc.He likes it ,and is going with the rack,but said I could go with the two channel for what I need.What do you think?


Seems completely reasonable. I don't use ProTools anymore but it's not a bad ware by any stretch.

Two channel I/O is fine for most people's needs. You really only need more if you intend on recording more than two channels at a time. IE like recording a full combo vs just laying down tracks as an individual.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks man,yhea my son needs more,being a drummer and playing more.So this should be enough for me.I just want to post some sounds on here.I guess tools do have a place in my perfect world ,too.
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